Todd Brown, Todd’s “E5” Funnel Secrets To Creating and Scaling Funnels To Maximize Profits

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YouTube Transcript: English (auto-generated)

00:00
welcome to funnel hacker radio podcast
00:03
where we go behind the scenes and
00:05
uncover the tactics and strategies top
00:07
entrepreneurs are using to make more
00:09
sales dominate their market and how you
00:12
can get those same results here is your
00:14
host dave woodward hey everybody welcome
00:18
back to photo hacker radio you guys are
00:20
in for a super treat today I have the
00:22
opportunity and having my very first
00:24
time ever having a guest come back for a
00:26
repeat performance so with a huge
00:29
applause I know you guys can’t clap too
00:31
loud for but Todd Brown welcome i’m so
00:33
excited to have you I’m so pumped to be
00:35
here man super super jacked this is so
00:38
good for those you guys don’t know Todd
00:40
you should you’ve already listed all my
00:41
episodes I’m doing by now but if ya
00:42
thought obviously founder of marketing
00:45
funnel automation he is a huge huge
00:47
supporter clickfunnels he was our very
00:49
first ability to ever win a car from us
00:51
I was a dear friend and most importantly
00:54
I think that part that you guys who are
00:56
listening Todd is a guy who totally
01:00
understands the metrics and understands
01:01
how to really get a funnel to actually
01:04
perform and I know everyone is listening
01:05
to their primary focus on obviously is
01:07
how I actually make money and how do I
01:10
get this done so Todd if you don’t mind
01:11
I look to dive right in and let’s kind
01:13
of talk about what it is you guys do
01:15
over at marketing automation to get it
01:17
you know do all the research into
01:18
testing the rollout of a new phone what
01:20
do you guys do how do you make it you
01:22
guys are crushed us how you doing it
01:23
yeah I appreciate that man first let me
01:25
say this dude I have to get this out
01:27
there I don’t think I’ve even announced
01:29
it to my list yet but i can’t i cannot
01:32
even tell you how excited i am to have
01:35
the opportunity to present again at a
01:39
phone hacking live i think we’re just a
01:42
handful of weeks away and and i am
01:45
pumped man i don’t think i’ve been this
01:47
pumped for an external event for an
01:49
event outside of our own event man and
01:51
so i’m not sure when folks are going to
01:54
be listening to this but hopefully they
01:56
either have their ticket already or or
01:59
they’re going to at least listen to the
02:01
recordings in the future if there are
02:02
recordings available or or your beat and
02:05
you missed out on a great event oh all
02:08
right but but so you know what what
02:11
what we’ve done I think the biggest
02:14
thing Dave since the last time I was on
02:17
here is we really started to bring our
02:22
methodology around creating a customer
02:26
acquisition marketing funnel which we
02:28
call 'if I’ve camp customer acquisition
02:32
marketing protocol we’ve really taken
02:34
that from being the thing that we only
02:37
teach to our highest end clients to um
02:41
we really began introducing it more and
02:44
more to to our tribe as a whole and
02:49
that’s really the focus for us over the
02:51
next 12 months is really making our
02:54
methodology which I’d love to kind of
02:55
share i’d love to break down me five for
03:00
everybody but that’s really the focus
03:01
and that’s that’s the process that we
03:04
use to go from really the idea for a
03:10
customer acquiring marketing funnel all
03:13
the way through to the designing and
03:16
engineering of it the testing and then
03:18
the the optimizing if you will and then
03:21
the the rolling out and so if you want I
03:23
could go through the you know I can go
03:25
through the different steps so that
03:27
everybody can kind of write some take
03:29
some notes and start to understand the
03:31
process well I would love because I have
03:32
no idea what a five mean so yeah in the
03:35
op no no no one else does so let’s dive
03:37
into it yeah you got it man so in the
03:39
process so e5 of course it’s it’s there
03:42
are five main stages that we go through
03:46
these are the same stages that I teach
03:47
to all of our students and more
03:49
importantly these are the same stages is
03:51
that that I go through that my team goes
03:54
through and we create a funnel
03:55
internally when we create a funnel for a
03:57
one of our agency clients etc and so the
04:01
very first step which is arguably the
04:04
driest step but it’s also one of the
04:06
most valuable steps in the entire
04:08
process is the first e EG in the e5
04:11
customer acquisition marketing protocol
04:13
stands for represents a different stage
04:16
the first e is examined and this is
04:19
really you could kind of replace the
04:21
word examine with the word
04:24
research and really what we’re looking
04:27
at here is there’s a process that we go
04:29
through for looking at three different
04:30
elements we’re looking at three
04:33
different elements which I’ll share in
04:34
just a second because frankly all of the
04:37
fodder all of the information all the
04:39
benefits all the fears all of the hooks
04:42
everything that we need to know about
04:45
how to best craft our offer how to best
04:48
craft our marketing hook how to best
04:51
craft our marketing message comes from
04:53
this examination stage comes from this
04:55
research stage of these of these three
04:57
different areas and the three different
04:59
areas are first and foremost our
05:02
prospects and of course this is typical
05:05
you know everybody listening to this
05:07
most likely has heard this before you
05:09
really want to understand what makes
05:10
your prospects tick psychologically
05:12
their fears their desires did the
05:14
outcome that they’re looking for kind of
05:17
their their existing beliefs you know
05:19
their their their wants their emotions
05:22
right where they’re kind of what they’re
05:24
dealing with their situation their
05:27
experience you really want a
05:28
three-dimensional picture of your
05:30
prospects so as part of the examination
05:32
stage there’s a series of things that we
05:34
that will do to examine prospect the
05:37
second category that we look at during
05:39
this examination stage is competitors
05:41
now here we r we kind of will in in this
05:46
context right here this is a little bit
05:48
different from funnel hacking like your
05:51
listeners are no doubt familiar with
05:53
from you guys and from Russell here in
05:56
this context what we’re looking at is
05:57
we’re looking at what your top direct
06:01
response competitors are doing and
06:03
saying in terms of their marketing hook
06:06
their unique mechanism which is the kind
06:11
of the unique way that they deliver the
06:13
benefits that they’re promising to
06:15
deliver and we look at their offer and
06:18
the reason why we’re examining
06:20
competitors at this stage is because
06:22
when it comes time for us to engineer
06:25
our our irresistible and superior offer
06:29
we want to make sure that it’s superior
06:31
to competitors so we’re not in this
06:34
stage Dave we’re not examining
06:36
competitors to
06:38
to model them we’re really examining
06:40
competitor so we know what we’re not
06:42
going to do or so we know what’s not
06:45
sufficient not good enough the third
06:47
category that we examine is the the
06:51
product or the service and this happens
06:54
whether it’s your own product or
06:55
somebody else’s product and here is
06:58
where we dig into the product because
07:00
oftentimes the ideas the hook for the
07:05
marketing message is going to come from
07:08
the product it was guys like Jean
07:12
Schwartz that talked about you know that
07:15
your marketing hook your your marketing
07:18
message copyrights itself when you know
07:21
your prospect and you know your product
07:24
right the the marketing message your
07:27
it’s not based on your creativity it’s
07:29
not based on wild levels of you know
07:32
like of your your ability to string
07:34
together it comes from a deep
07:37
understanding of your prospect and a
07:39
deep set of a deep knowledge of your
07:43
product or service and so that’s why we
07:44
always begin with that examination stage
07:47
and when you do the examination of those
07:49
three elements you’re really kind of
07:51
fully equipped for the second stage and
07:54
so before I go to that does that make
07:55
sense day for the first II that’s
07:57
awesome i think i like and i love a
08:00
commitment in there as far as the whole
08:01
you know product service piece on the
08:03
end i reckon the marketing it’s right
08:05
itself i think if you do it right man
08:06
yet crushes that so i think that’s
08:08
fantastic yeah and that’s like I I can’t
08:11
stress that enough for everybody frankly
08:13
like if you get nothing else from this
08:14
podcast episode but you really get this
08:17
fact that like the more in tune you the
08:20
more you dive in the more time you
08:23
invest and spend digging through the
08:25
product and exploring the product
08:27
looking for these little nuances looking
08:30
for these little buzz words looking for
08:31
these little kind of terms and phrases
08:33
and looking for these little nuggets of
08:36
interest and insight into kind of the
08:39
story behind the the the product to
08:42
service the book the info course you
08:45
know whatever it is oh my gosh to copy
08:48
just it becomes so much easier and so
08:50
that’s
08:51
step one so step two is really where the
08:55
the bulk of kind of uh of what it is
08:59
that we do comes into play and e to the
09:02
second E is the engineering stage and
09:06
the engineering stage is of course where
09:08
we design our first iteration or first
09:12
version of the funnel we refer to that
09:13
funnel as a Minimum Viable funnel but I
09:17
want to kind of share the the key and
09:20
I’m packing it in Dave I’m packing it in
09:22
there so I’m going at lightning pace and
09:26
I love it so the keys here are when it
09:30
comes to the engineering when it comes
09:33
to the engineering number one we start
09:35
with the offer this is kind of crazy
09:38
when you think about it most people most
09:40
marketers will often save the offer for
09:43
the end most marketers will start with
09:45
the headline or they’ll start with kind
09:47
of the the lead the opening of the of
09:49
the marketing funnel we start with the
09:51
offer because the offer is one of the
09:54
most critical the most essential
09:56
components in the entire marketing
09:58
funnel and offer the right offer a great
10:00
offer and irresistible superior offer
10:02
can double triple response whereas a
10:05
garbage week offer can radically
10:07
suppress response so we always start
10:10
with the offer our goal our aim is to
10:13
create a superior and irresistible offer
10:16
what do I mean by superior superior to
10:19
competitors and what we do is we take
10:23
the different components of an offer
10:25
each component separately like let’s say
10:28
for example the risk reversal like the
10:31
premiums or bonuses right in each piece
10:35
of the offer we are striving
10:37
individually to make that superior to
10:41
what competitors are offering so we’ll
10:43
look at let’s say our top five to seven
10:46
competitors direct response competitors
10:47
will look at their premiums and then we
10:49
strive to make our premiums better
10:52
superior much more valuable we’ll look
10:54
at their risk reversals our top five to
10:56
seven direct response competitors and
10:58
then we strive to make a bigger bolder
11:00
more daring risk reversal or guarantee
11:03
and we do that for each
11:04
for each piece for each component of the
11:08
offer then once we’ve assembled an
11:11
irresistible and superior offer based on
11:14
our examination of competitors and based
11:17
on what we know about our prospect and
11:20
what they want and our product or
11:22
service then we craft then we go into
11:27
the kind of the the really the
11:30
foundation of engineering a marketing
11:34
funnel with our approach and it involves
11:37
really three things it involves number
11:41
one what you and I talked about I think
11:44
or maybe we didn’t talk about it or
11:47
maybe we touched on it I can’t remember
11:48
on the last episode but it actually is
11:52
what I’m going to be talking about at
11:53
funnel hacking live which is the big
11:55
idea and how you actually develop an
11:58
idea behind your marketing funnel behind
12:01
your marketing message an idea that is
12:03
emotionally compelling the prospects and
12:06
intellectually interesting and there’s a
12:08
formula that you can you can follow
12:10
there is a process that you can follow
12:13
and um and so that’s one of the most
12:16
valuable marketing lessons that I’ve
12:18
ever learned and that is how to develop
12:22
the big idea and how to spot a big idea
12:25
and so that’s one thing again I’m going
12:26
to be sharing that and I’m so excited
12:29
for this I’m going to be sharing that at
12:30
funnel hacking live and then we you know
12:34
then the engineering process is includes
12:37
coming up with the marketing funnel
12:40
thesis which is kind of like the one
12:42
overarching belief that you need
12:44
prospects to have before you make your
12:46
offer right so it’s you know the big
12:49
idea gets their attention creates
12:51
engagement sucks them into your funnel
12:52
makes them feel like this is new this is
12:55
different this is unique this is
12:56
exciting i want to hear more about this
12:58
right um and ultimately then the the
13:01
message the funnel leads to a to the
13:05
establishing of this thesis this one
13:07
overarching belief this one belief that
13:10
they need to buy and in between the big
13:13
idea and the thesis is what we call the
13:16
marketing argument where base
13:17
you’re laying out an emotional and
13:20
logical argument for why your prospect
13:23
in essence should believe that that your
13:26
product or service that your solution is
13:29
the ideal solution for for their needs
13:33
and when you take the big idea to get
13:35
attention engagement cut through the
13:37
noise cut through the clutter you put
13:38
together a rock-solid airtight marketing
13:42
argument which you know we won’t get
13:43
into the weeds in terms of the steps of
13:45
that but the marketing argument leading
13:47
to the establishment of this thesis the
13:49
one belief that they need to have in
13:51
order to buy and then you present your
13:53
irresistible and superior offer you are
13:56
you’re off to the races and so that’s
13:59
the the engineering stage and then just
14:01
very quickly for time i’ll give you the
14:02
other three the other three stages and
14:05
so the the next stage is evaluate and
14:08
this is where we actually take this
14:10
first version of the of the the funnel
14:14
the minimum viable funnel and we
14:16
evaluate the effectiveness of the idea
14:19
of the marketing argument of the core
14:22
offer i before we create the upsell
14:27
sequence the add-on sequence you know
14:29
before we create the email follow
14:30
sequence before we create all those
14:31
things we evaluate the funnel in essence
14:33
we test the funnel we test to make sure
14:34
that we put together something that has
14:37
legs before we put together all these
14:39
other components that don’t are
14:41
unnecessary unless the the main core
14:44
offer works works well after the
14:47
evaluation stage depending on the
14:49
performance like depending on what
14:51
percentage of ROI you get we may either
14:54
move back to the engineering stage or
14:57
more likely we move forward to the to
15:02
the enhanced stage the enhanced stage is
15:04
really kind of where we add in the
15:06
elements that were missing so we follow
15:08
a certain protocol for adding in the
15:10
upsell down cells add-on offers email
15:13
follow-up sequence and this is kind of a
15:15
stage where you then begin to optimize
15:16
so you’ve created your your initial
15:19
version of your funnel you’ve evaluated
15:20
it with a you know with traffic with
15:23
cold traffic it’s met a minimum criteria
15:27
to go on to the next stage we then begin
15:29
to enhance it by adding
15:31
things like the bump offer that you guys
15:33
really popularized in the upsell down
15:36
fell kind of sequence email follow-up
15:37
sequence and then you go on to the fifth
15:40
stage and the fifth stage is what we
15:42
call expand and in this stage is when we
15:45
kind of you begin to scale and you
15:48
expand things like your traffic budget
15:51
your your your audience your your
15:54
channels and then ultimately you go on
15:56
to the next offer and so that makes
15:58
sense holy cow so basically you can take
16:03
your mouth off of the fire hydrants yeah
16:05
that was awesome thought nobody complete
16:08
sense I mean this is why I was dying to
16:10
have you on so happy they time for us
16:13
bit I think it’s so important cause I
16:15
hope you guys go back and listen to this
16:17
again I didn’t even want to interrupt on
16:18
if he was going I mean Todd you know we
16:21
before we got on we’re talking about how
16:23
this has really become your life’s work
16:24
and my god is going to totally master
16:27
this this is fantastic I mean I on it so
16:31
cool yeah I thought I appreciate that so
16:34
much i’m super excited about it i hope
16:35
that everybody else is really super
16:37
excited about it and i think that like
16:40
look you know we did we covered right
16:41
like a few we covered our whole you know
16:44
like a big fifty thousand foot view of
16:47
our entire e5 you know camp framework
16:50
but i think what’s most important for
16:52
everybody to really to really or one of
16:54
the big things to really get from this
16:56
is to have a process to recognize that
16:59
you know you got to start by doing your
17:00
examination you have to start by doing
17:02
the research you can’t ignore it yes
17:04
it’s not the most exciting aspect of of
17:06
what it is that we do yes it can be dry
17:08
yes it can be time consuming but trust
17:10
me it’s where the fodder and the and the
17:13
nuggets for your marketing message are
17:15
going to come then we talked about then
17:17
you go into engineer and only only after
17:19
that point do you engineer you start
17:21
with the offer you put together the
17:22
absolute best most compelling most
17:24
insane offer that you possibly can right
17:26
and then you have to come up with a
17:28
great idea that’s emotionally compelling
17:30
intellectually and you have to know
17:31
what’s the one belief that you’re trying
17:33
to instill in your prospect the one
17:35
belief that they need to have in order
17:36
to buy you know your product or service
17:39
in order to take advantage of your offer
17:41
and then once you put that together
17:42
don’t bother putting together all
17:45
of these other pieces like the upsell
17:46
sequence the back end or anything until
17:49
you evaluate and test that the core
17:51
offer is going to it’s going to do its
17:53
job and then once you’ve done that
17:55
evaluation then you go on to adding in
17:57
these other pieces and optimizing and
17:59
then after that then you go and you
18:01
begin to expand your reach you begin to
18:03
roll out that campaign and so if you
18:05
really think about that absorb it listen
18:07
to this episode again I think that
18:08
you’ll find some a clear path to follow
18:11
and and some nuggets I mean I just love
18:14
again to the main takeaways obviously I
18:17
we talked about a first one that was the
18:19
idea that barge and marketing essence
18:21
exactly written right so I hope you know
18:23
the product service at the very
18:24
beginning but I think the most important
18:26
thing i got was all that zombies made
18:28
men show and that is the point of
18:29
starting with the offer oh my gosh I we
18:33
put the subtle stuff we’ve done here
18:34
recently and it’s been amazing when you
18:36
start with that offer everything else
18:38
just falls into place especially if you
18:41
think my god fuck it if your offer
18:43
superior to competitors it literally
18:44
becomes a no-brainer for anybody’s
18:45
looking at your offers like well I you
18:47
can screw up a lot of the funnel that
18:49
the offers right so I think that is yeah
18:51
awesome yeah that’s let me and let me
18:54
say their state I I think that what you
18:56
just said it is worth uh you know is
18:59
worth its weight in gold and it’s so
19:00
spot on that legitimately the like when
19:03
you have an over-the-top crazy
19:04
unbelievable offer you really can um you
19:08
know screw up multiple parts of the
19:10
funnel and and still do well and so it’s
19:12
wildly valuable the other thing that I
19:14
and I would just say this if I didn’t
19:16
mean it and I’m not saying that’s just
19:18
because if I’m on this podcast was a few
19:19
but one of the best people at creating
19:22
just killer ridiculous offers is Russell
19:26
if you look at Russell if you look at
19:29
many of the offers that Russell puts
19:32
together you’ll find that every reason
19:34
for not buying every excuse for not
19:37
buying every potential objection that I
19:39
could have to not buy everything that I
19:42
could say but what about this or but
19:45
what about that or but don’t I need this
19:47
Russell builds in to the offer so that
19:50
you you you’re literate you’re literally
19:52
led to the point where you say and this
19:54
is the goal why wouldn’t I do this what
19:57
would I not be Eva
19:59
I love it Todd you are a magician at
20:02
this stuff it’s just awesome i love
20:04
seeing and you’re such a great job of
20:06
really breaking things down into such a
20:08
consumable way of actually making it
20:12
work for people so I was dying to have
20:14
you on again for those you guys i hope i
20:16
hope everyone to this already has their
20:18
tickets to attend not lacking live you
20:20
don’t apologize for that you’ll make
20:22
sure you’re not there you joke screw up
20:23
next year but most importantly is
20:26
understands the stuff that Todd’s
20:28
talking about Todd is he he’s not new to
20:31
this game I hope you got to understand
20:32
it todd has literally been doing this
20:34
that’s why they’re kind of joking around
20:35
about as far as Covina’s life’s work
20:37
prod you just spend more time on this
20:39
than anybody I know I mean you have you
20:40
dive into the numbers you understand
20:43
exactly what it takes and you’re a
20:44
master at really figuring out the
20:47
prospect and what what it is that they
20:49
want what they what is they need and how
20:52
to really push the emotional button so
20:53
that if you created a killer product
20:56
it’s a no brainer you want to make sure
20:57
everything every single person out there
20:59
used it consumes it and gets the results
21:01
that you’re talking about so you guys
21:03
again I love working you guys just
21:05
amazing ditto brother BAM like did oh
21:08
it’s so my pleasure i was probably
21:10
equally as excited to be on here
21:14
chatting with you man and so it’s always
21:17
my pleasure i love what you guys are
21:19
doing man just it goes without saying
21:21
dude that uh you know I’m a big big big
21:24
big fan of you guys and what you’re
21:26
doing and so it’s always my pleasure
21:28
brother well thank you so much so tell
21:30
me how do people get a hold a sign oh
21:31
very first thing I’m going to get people
21:33
hit me up on email boxer texting
21:35
everyone daytime get all the cost so if
21:38
you don’t mind us flex it for me yeah
21:40
they could just go over to marketing
21:41
funnel automation comm check out our
21:44
blog you could go over to six figure
21:48
funnel formula dot-com unjust yeah man
21:51
enjoy we put out a bunch of a bunch of
21:54
free content and hopefully for those of
21:57
you that are listening to this that are
21:58
going to be at funnel hacking live
22:00
definitely make sure that you come up
22:02
and introduce yourself I’ll be
22:04
presenting as well as doing like a round
22:07
table gig and soap man like you know any
22:10
questions about what it is that I shared
22:11
on this if you’re going to be there come
22:13
up to
22:13
ask me love to help you awesome i look
22:16
again guys if you’re at phone hacking
22:17
lives understand the reason i want to
22:19
make sure we had solid on base for fun
22:21
packing lives is i want you guys just to
22:22
get a little little piece of flavor
22:24
before he speaks because i would
22:27
recommend that you get a hold of tops of
22:29
40 talks because he’s going to be
22:30
bombarded afterwards so again Todd
22:33
actually was going to be speaking he has
22:34
a round table I believe mark photo
22:37
automation also going to be one of our
22:39
sponsors so we’re so excited to be
22:40
working with you guys again make sure
22:43
you’re at the event you get a hold of
22:45
todd get hold of this team spent the
22:47
time and really make it work for you
22:48
guys awesome thank you dude what’s
22:52
happening again Todd can’t wait to see
22:53
you got just like a four weeks away so I
22:55
know I’m really not cited man and if
22:58
there’s anything that we can do for you
23:00
guys if there’s anything that you you
23:02
need and I don’t say that as like a hey
23:04
throw that out if there’s anything that
23:05
you guys need if there’s any whatever
23:07
we’re here for you guys in whatever way
23:08
possible man I appreciate it off to you
23:10
know that goes both ways thanks again
23:12
Todd I can’t wait to you soon fall soon
23:14
bye bye thanks for listening to funnel
23:16
hacker radio podcast if you’d like to be
23:17
notified any time we release a new
23:19
episode just subscribe over at funnel
23:21
hacker radio com in addition to that
23:24
we’d love to send you a free gift you
23:26
can find that free gift at funnel hacker
23:28
radio com forward slash retrial one last
23:32
thing is we love giving away cars don’t
23:35
you like access to a free dream car all
23:37
you have to do is go to frontal hacker
23:39
radio com forward slash dream car and
23:42
you’ll get all the details thanks again
23:44
for listening

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